Comments on: Righteous Gentiles

By: Eliyahou in Jerusalem

Eliyahou in Jerusalem — Mon, 14 Feb 2005 07:38:37 +0000

Readers here would do well to realise that when a non-Jew says “study”, the non-Jew means just that — not “learn in ‘havruta” or “be taught by a rav”, as Jews often mean. “Study” usually denotes individual academic enquiry. Hence Toby Katz asks the real question for us in comment #5. But that was not the question asked by the Canadian fellow.

Before my geirut I was told by a rabbi that I was welcome to attend shiurim, but that I should make sure that whoever was counting guys for minyan did not include me. That was perhaps not the final psak din, but that was my modus operandi until I stepped into the (Orthodox) mikveh seven years later. I was essentially self-taught at that point, and had had quite few restrictions placed upon me. (An example was that I was not allowed to put on tefillin until a few days before the geirut. But then, I had asked permission.) I could walk into my university library at any time and read the Soncino Talmud.

A similar question arises about a non-Jew being shomer Shabbat. It is common knowledge that a non-Jew “must” me’hallel Shabbat somehow (and there are various shitot that make it easy), and some may even know that a non-Jew who keeps Shabbat 100% is ‘hayav mita. Needless to say that death penalty is not enforced. Likewise here I find it spurious to talk about what a non-Jew is “allowed” or “not allowed” to do.

(PS to othello: Why do you assume that YY Reinman did not have permission to post the letter? Or is this a general rant?)

By: Yaakov Rosenblatt

Yaakov Rosenblatt — Fri, 11 Feb 2005 17:44:15 +0000

I have recently began teaching a Bnei Noach group in Texas and every one of these issues has come up. Thanks for bringing it up on cross-currents and uncovering resources for us. I recently asked a Rav about tefillos (prayers). He told me that they can use our Tefillos - even saying “Elokei (God of) Avraham Yitzchak V’Yaakov” - but must remove refrences like “elokei avoseinu” (God of our fathers). The former merely identifies God they are praying to as the Unity defined by yiddishkeit.

By: J. L. Joseph

J. L. Joseph — Thu, 10 Feb 2005 22:49:36 +0000

It should be pointed out the R. J. David Bleich also takes somewhat of an interest in the halachot of teaching Torah to non-Jews, especially via “Contemporary Halakhic Problems”.

By: othello

othello — Thu, 10 Feb 2005 01:04:04 +0000

1) I’d think that the appropriate thing to do is to be helpful as possible, given the potential for chilul hashem if one is not.
2) With no disrespect intended, I think the odds of said gentleman finding his email posted here is relatively high. I’m a little nonplussed at discovering bloggers here posting emails - minus names, true, although last time around the post had other identifiers. This is the web; folks will find what they thought to be a private email on a public site. Unless there was permission to post, it seems unwise to do so.

By: Toby Katz

Toby Katz — Thu, 10 Feb 2005 00:23:30 +0000

AFAIK the halachic questions have to do with how much a Jew is allowed to teach a Noahide, not what a Noahide is allowed to study on his own. I don’t think he is forbidden to read any book that is available in English.

As for the specific question of his entering a Conservative temple to pray, IMO
that is not much better than a church because he will be taught a false understanding
of Torah there, which is worse than if he had not studied Torah at all.

By: YU Educated

YU Educated — Thu, 10 Feb 2005 00:16:10 +0000

The Rav ZT”L originally gave the lecture for the Lonely Man of Faith in a Catholic Seminary in Brighton Mass. As can be seen in the article-the Torah Shebeal Peh is in the footnotes-which obviously were not spoken to the Seminary. Interesting vignette to at least how one Gadol acted.

By: J. L. Joseph

J. L. Joseph — Wed, 09 Feb 2005 23:26:47 +0000

Rav Yoel Schwartz with Rav Yechiel Sitzman (Yeshivat Dvar Yerushalayim) give advice and opinions concerning the Noachide laws frequently, notably on the Yahaoo group:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NoachideChassid/

One Chabad site has specific recommendations for b’nai Noach learning:

http://www.askmoses.com/qa_detail.html?o=409

When ‘Noahides’ are told to find for themselves a single rabbinic authority and follow his instructions, they are frequently unhappy and avoid doing so.

As for Jewish obligations, two handy articles on the web by R. Michael J. Broyde are:

http://www.jlaw.com/Articles/noach2.html

http://www.jlaw.com/LawPolicy/MITTLEMA.pdf

By: Gil

Gil — Wed, 09 Feb 2005 21:50:31 +0000

The Maharatz Chajes to Sotah 35b writes that a Jew may teach Tanach to a gentile. The Netziv (Meshiv Davar, Yoreh Deah 77) and R. Yehudah Assad (Yehudah Ya’aleh, Orah Hayim 4) rule similarly. This might have been the Rambam’s intention in Responsa Pe’er Ha-Dor 50. But my impression is that the majority of posekim disagree with this view and I was told not to follow it.

For a full discussion, see R. Ovadiah Yosef’s Yabia Omer, vol. 2 Yoreh Deah 17 and and his son’s footnotes to Pe’er Ha-Dor.

By: Zev

Zev — Wed, 09 Feb 2005 21:37:29 +0000

There are several Noahide communities in the US. I remember reading in an article (and later confirming) that one of them would bring their sha’alos in hilchos b’nei Noach to R’ Yaakov Weinberg z”l.